To the more than 10,000 law enforcement agencies who use them, Taser-style stun guns probably seem like a godsend — a quick jolt of electricity and even the brawniest and most berserk criminal can be brought to the ground. No guns, no deaths and no permanent damage.
Or so Taser International, the weapon’s manufacturer, would have you believe.
However, a CrunchGear investigation paints a different picture. Not only have at least 167 people died after being Tasered, according to The Arizona Republic (although the number of these deaths that can be directly attributed to the weapons is disputed), but there appears to be an aggressive effort by the company to silence critics and to control data and, on occasion, manipulate statistics with the intent of preserving an illusion of safety surrounding its products.
What follows is a column, and is opinion. All statements of fact have been attributed to sources. I have to say this because Taser is a highly litigious company that does not take kindly to criticism, as you shall see.
Not surprisingly, Taser executives are adamant about the safety of its products — ask one and they’ll likely bring up the “hundreds” of Taser shots they’ve taken themselves over the years.
In fact, Taser is so proactive in painting the image of its products as safe that it offers to shoot anybody who approaches the company’s booths at trade shows — an offer that ABC News reporter Amanda Congdon took up at CES this year in one of the show’s most memorable moments (an act that Jon Stewart called “Look-at-me-reporter-crap”).
And the company is quick to tout the devices’ law enforcement benefits. “The field results are extraordinary and dramatic,” says Steve Tuttle, Taser International’s vice president of communications. “We’re reducing officer-related shootings. Here in Phoenix there was a 54-percent drop in officer-related shootings that Phoenix reported as a direct result of Taser technology.”
This would be great, if it weren’t a spin on the facts. A quick call to the Phoenix Police Department revealed this statistic to be highly misleading.
“Tasers were deployed to everybody in the department beginning in 2003,” says Dave Kelly, a Phoenix Police Department lieutenant who works in officer training. “We went from 24 officer-related shootings in 2002 to 12 in 2003. But we didn’t stay there. In 2004, we had 20. It really bounces back and forth. Can we attribute any drop to the implementation of the Taser? I’m not comfortable saying we can.”
However, for the sake of balance it must be noted that Kelly, as well as other law enforcement officials I spoke to, say Tasers have an important place in law enforcement when responsibly implemented. Of course, it is only logical that having access to a weapon less lethal than a gun would prevent deaths. This statistical manipulation, though, appears emblematic of how the company handles data related to the safety and effects of its devices.
Double-blind
I come from a family of scientists and was raised to believe that the peer-reviewed system of verifying and disseminating scientific data is the best we have. From a personal standpoint, the most offensive actions from the company are undoubtedly its practice of suing medical examiners as well as researchers who have published peer-reviewed reports critical of Taser’s products. Not only does this violate the good faith of the scientific community, but it has a chilling effect on research — discouraging scientists from even touching related studies out of fear of retaliation. This was confirmed by a number of scientists who refused to speak to me on the record regarding Taser out of fear of reprisals.
Taser’s lawsuits include cases against medical examiners in Indiana and Ohio who cited Taser-induced electrical shocks as the cause of death. But perhaps most striking is the case of James Ruggieri. In early 2006, Ruggieri published an article in the peer-reviewed Journal of the National Academy of Forensic Engineers. The study, “one of the few scientific studies of Taser’s electric jolt in which the company did not participate,” as The Arizona Republic put it, concluded that Tasers were far more powerful than the company acknowledged and that the devices are capable of causing fatal heart rhythms.
Not taking the criticism lightly, the company sued Ruggieri for defamation, claiming he lacked the expertise to make such judgments, even though his story passed through the rigors of the peer-review screening process.
“They are ruling with a very heavy hand all the data,” says one researcher who requested anonymity on the subject, again out of fear of retaliation. “An immediate red flag in the scientific community is ‘who is funding the source.’ I’m not aware of that many independent studies on the safety of Tasers — most of the research is from people who are somehow associated with the company.”
While the number of completely independent studies on the dangers of Tasers is limited, some of the ones that do exist suggest they are anything but harmless — particularly in regards to their effects on the heart and the nervous system.
For example, in addition to Ruggieri’s study, a recent study conducted by scientists in Toronto on pigs showed that Taser shots to the chest can interfere with heart rhythms in a way that causes instant death. (To avoid such results, if somebody must get shocked, Dr. Zian Tseng, MD, an assistant professor of medicine at the University of California-San Francisco, suggests law enforcement aim for the limbs or back, so as to avoid effecting the heart. And, if possible, he suggests Taser-issued officers carry defibrillators in the trunks of their cars in order to respond to any unexpected cardiac issues.)
And then there are the effects of Tasers on the human brain and nervous system. Although there is very little research on this, studies have been conducted examining the effects of electrical shocks that are virtually identical to the ones delivered by Tasers. These studies suggest such shocks can cause serious, and potentialy long-term, damage to cognition and the central nervous system.
“For the most part, the only information that’s available is promotional information provided by the company,” says Neil Pliskin, Ph.D. director of neuropsychology and professor of clinical psychiatry and neurology at the University of Illinois at Chicago. “Some electrically injured patients are at risk for other types of insults to their brain and central nervous system, and it would seem to be incumbent on the scientific community and those who are interested in the effects of electrical shock to look at this issue. Any risk of electrical shock could theoretically be applied in consideration of Tasers, although until scientific information comes out either in support or against it, it would just be speculative. The problem is that studies still need to be done. But lets put it this way: If it was me invited to go over and get shocked at their booth, I’d probably decline it.”
Better Than a Gunshot
Even Taser’s harshest critics acknowledge that being shocked is highly preferable to a gunshot. The problem seems to be that in its proactive presentation of the products as nearly-harmless — through a combination of suing critics (effectively silencing potential critics), controlling relevant research, and offering Taser shocks to anybody who passes by its booths at conventions — the public perception of Tasers becomes one of a device that is entirely non-lethal, making their misuse inevitable. Just ask Mustafa Tabatabainejad.
RELATED: Tasers: A Shock To The System (PC Magazine)
UPDATE – TASER’s Mark W. Kroll [BIO] responds in an email:
The infamous Ruggieri clearly does not count as he is a high-school
dropout fired by the Coast Guard where he had been hired by falsely
claiming to be an engineer. His junk science manuscript, “Lethality of
TASERs” was rejected by the reviewers for the Journal of Forensic
Science so he has never had a peer-reviewed article. Ruggieiri got a
friend to do a photocopy “publication” of an amusing piece which
claimed, among other things, that cardiomyopathy patients could die
from the static shock of walking across carpet or combing their hair.
He also apparently solved the energy problem by getting 704 watts out
of a TASER device powered by a 30 watt pack of 8 AA cells. One glance
at this piece will disabuse anyone of the fantasy that it was ever peer
reviewed.
Kroll also asserts that TASER has never sued a peer-reviewed researcher.
You are full of shit
TASERS SAVES LIVES EVERYDAY
Really you dumb ass? I was tazed 3 times and it was held on me for a count of at least 5 plus seconds. I have gouges in my back and arm. I am a 100 lb woman and TWO male police OFFICERS could very easily save turned me around and cuffed me, INSTEAD they prefered to throw me to the ground and electrocute me. I have wounds that will not heal and horriible heart pain at 39 yrs old. What did I do? I called the police for HELP. They save lives??? They have taken my health and scarred me for life. FUCK YOU. I’d like you to take three long shots from one and then tell me how your life was saved.
Lemme make this simple if a cop is shooting you with a taser then technically by force continuum models used in most police forces he probably has the option to shoot you. I don’t know about you but I’d rather be hit with a “Less than Lethal” taser than a 9mm piece of lead anyway. Finally a remember a taser is less than lethal not non lethal as it is so often touted, everything is lethal in the right dose. A taser is simply a weapon designed to give an officer something to use in between beating you over the head with a stick and shooting you.
Let me make this simple, too:
In the cases where both the taser and the gun would work, it’s of course preferrable to use the taser.
But guns are not used that often, because cops know they probably kill. They’ll think twice.
If a cop thinks a taser is harmless, he will use it in much less threatening situations. You can find videos on youtube which show cops using the taser as a compliance tool in nonthreatening situations. And that is the problem. Tasers aren’t less than lethal, the correct term is “less lethal”
It’s very alarming if scientific research is suppressed.
i agree with chrs they wont us the taser unless its an emergencey
Then you must live in a very happy land, where cops never abuse their power, and no one has ever been tazed just because a cop felt his authority was being challenged.
While the theory that Tasers could adversely affect the heart seems plausible, the theory that it might affect the brain does not (unless someone is shot in the head) because current basically runs between the two projectile electrodes and doesn’t travel to distant locations in the body. I haven’t seen a Taser manual but I bet they say not to shoot people in the head.
Exactly. Like most law enforcement officials, I believe Taser-type weapons have a place. The problem is that the company is going to what I believe are extreme lenghts to perserve the image of their products as nearly harmless. Publicity stunts and bad TV (think Jackass) regularly employ Tasers for comedic value because everybody thinks they are just a gag–harmless, if painful.
What really bothers me is the chilling effect on the scientific community. When a private corporation starts derailing the peer-reviewed process for monetary reasons, we have a problem.
I spoke to many scientists who had problems with the company and their products, but who refused to be quoted on the record because they were certain they would be sued for speaking out. To me, that is evidence enough of a chilling effect.
It’s good that cops have other less-lethal options, like the Tasers, but it begs the dangerous question of whether cops are reaching for them too easily in situations they wouldn’t even think about pulling guns in. We’ve all read stories about officers that get excited, get in wrong situations, etc., and get trigger happy as a result.
And the chilling effect on researchers is just frightening in any case. The suppression of facts isn’t helping the public or the police who may think these are safer to use than they really are, therefore, facing expensive, painful lawsuits.
The problem is not the tool, but one of human factor: does the officer employ deadly force or does the officer use “less-than-deadly” force?
Apart from questionable company (lack of) ethics, we need to examine the decision making process. When is it OK to use a gun, a baton, the pepper spray, Taser, harpoon, kung fu, etc to confront a particular situation. In addition to examining the scientific merit of Taser, we need to realize that training of the peace officer needs to improve. Ceteris paribus, I’d rather have someone talk to me to calm me down instead of firing 50000 volts down my spine because it’s “less deadly”.
re: Mike –
A Taser shock is remarkably similar to the type of charge used for electro-shock therapy in hospitals (think One Flew Over The Cuckoo’s Nest.) Such shocks can, and do, effect the brain and cognition. I spoke to a multitude of researchers who detailed such effects, including damage the central nervous system and cognition.
In a recent Canadian Broadcasting Corporation (CBC) in-depth documentary on Tasers which aired nationally on Canadian television, the conclusions of THREE recent independent medical studies on Tasers (two of them performed here in Canada) were revealed which raise some very serious questions about the lethality of Tasers.
The documentary, about 20 minutes in length, is available to watch online at http://www.cbc.ca/video/features/news/ Scroll down and click on “Taser Deaths”.
Highlights of the independent study conclusions:
1. Dr. Stanley Nattel, Cardiologist at the Montreal Heart Institute, Director of the Paul-David Chair in Cardiovascular Electrophysiology and leading cardiology researcher at the University of Montreal, and an associate professor at McGill University, concluded that “A rapid rhythm induced by a Taser, called a Ventricular Tachycardia, may not cause very severe symptoms and particularly if the person is very excited, frightened, etc., they might not even notice it. But that kind of rhythm can eventually what we call “degenerate” to Ventricular Fibrillation, which is an even faster and irregular rhythm that is rapidly lethal.” Dr. Nattel said further that “the way in which the Taser causes death is by provoking a very rapid, irregular heart rhythm, and that doesn’t leave any traces in the body. So basically if you don’t see anything there, you don’t know what the cause is and it could be a lethal dose of drugs or it could be an extreme mental stress or it could be the Taser. I don’t think it’s possible to differentiate those possibilities in most cases.” E-mail address: stanley.nattel@icm-mhi.org
2. Another recent independent study in Canada on the effects of Tasers on pigs was performed at the University of Toronto by Kumaraswamy Nanthakumar, MD; Ian Billingsley, MD, Stephane Masse, MASc, Paul Dorian, MD, Douglas Cameron, MD, Vijay S. Chauhan, MD, Eugene Downar, MD and Elias Sevaptsidis, DEC. This study injected into pigs a substance that mimics the adrenaline rush that would be experienced during a stressful arrest by police or a cocaine high. The pigs were then shocked with Tasers. The study found that, in circumstances of increased adrenalgenic stress, arrythmias (irregular heart rhythms) were caused and, in some cases, were lethal. (See the Journal of the American College of Cardiology: http://content.onlinejacc.org/cgi/content/abstract/j.jacc.2006.02.076v1)
3. In the U.S., Dr. John Webster, Biomedical Engineer, University of Wisconsin tried to duplicate the situation that would occur with humans … and “we got very different results. I don’t think that they’re non-lethal weapons but I think that there’s a probability, albeit small, that the Taser could electrocute a person.”
When asked by the CBC reporter what he would do if a study showed there was a risk, Taser International spokesperson Steve Tuttle answered by saying, “We would have an obligation to disclose that to our customers and to the public. That’s pure and simple.” However, to the best of my knowledge, Taser International has not disclosed the results from these studies to its customers or to the public.
The police will tell you that the people who have died proximal to Taser use have died of a condition they call “excited delirium.” This is not a medically recognized condition, but is only a theory that usually lets police off the hook and shifts the blame from the person exerting the force to the person who dies. I urge you to read the following reports from National Public Radio (NPR), released in late February:
Part 2 of 2 – February 27, 2007
http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=7622314
Part 1 of 2 – February 26, 2007
http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=7608386
The total number of deaths proximal to taser use is now 244. Since the beginning of 2007, NINE people have died in the United States, as follows:
236. Calvin Thompson, 42, Gastonia, North Carolina
January 5, 2007
237. Douglas Ilten, 45, Fort Pierce, Florida
January 6, 2007
238. Blondel Lassegue, 38, Queens, New York
January 7, 2007
239. Pete Carlos Madrid, 44, Fresno, California
January 9, 2007
240. Keith Kallstrom, 56, Milan, Michigan
January 17, 2007
241. Andrew J. Athetis, 18, Gilbert, Arizona
January 18, 2007
242. Unknown, Unknown, Huntington Park, California
January 29, 2007
243. Steven Krohn, 44, Mesa, Arizona
February 11, 2007
244. Martin Mendoza, 43, Vista, California
February 21, 2007
Are any of you actually law enforcement officers?
Ok, new question: who here has actually been tasered, and knows how it affects your body?
Ugh.
Let me do some statistics for you. I’ll just BS them, but you get the idea.
If a law enforcement officer chooses to draw his standard weapon and shoot you, he’s going to shoot to kill (not to injure or slow down.) Your chances of living are pretty much 0%.
If a law enforcement officer chooses to draw his taser weapon and shoot you, your chances of living are pretty much 99.999999%
Unless of course, you’re high on meth or have pre-existing problems. Then your chances decrease a bit.
But anyway, would you rather the officer use his billy club to beat you into submission? Shoot a beanbag at you? Pepper spray/balls? All have their pros and cons. I’ll take the taser over those any day of the week.
My final thoughts– If a law enforcement officer is crooked, he’s crooked regardless of the tools employed.
Tasers most certainly do have their place on the force spectrum. The problem is a company that seems intent on perpetuating confusion regarding what place that is. I’m confident that I’m safer being hit with a Taser than being shot, but how about a nightstick? Is a Taser safer than that? What about pepper spray? What about other traditional methods of restraint for an uncooperative suspect? Certainly a Taser is safer for the officer than pinning someone to the ground, but how little threat does a suspect need to pose before a Taser response should be regarded as unjustifiably risky to the suspect?
When the company insists that Tasers are absolutely safe, that carries some very strong implications. An absolutely safe weapon could be used to discourage a toddler from running into traffic. An absolutely safe weapon could be considered a preferable resolution to even simple verbal confrontation. The former example is hyperbolic, of course, but the latter is very close to the real abuse of Tasers: an officer believes a suspect is insufficiently deferential and teaches him a lesson with a Taser. It’s “absolutely safe,” so why not use it as a shortcut around any annoyance he might introduce into your day, however minor? Heck, why not Taser people routinely on traffic stops as an additional deterrent? It’s “absolutely safe,” after all.
The bottom line isn’t to say that Tasers are “bad,” but only that suppressing data on the real effects of this weapon prevents departments and officers from making responsible decisions about how to best integrate it into their arsenals and their tactics.
The question everyone has is not whether being shot with a gun or being shot with a taser is preferable, everyone would rather be shot with a taser. It’s a moot point that a taser is is less harmful than a gun *most* of the time. The dilemma is how often people are being shot at all. The psychological effect of having a less lethal weapon can be dramatic. You can escalate a confrontation faster and not have to worry since you have a weapon that you consider safe. You can use it as a compliance tool because you consider it safe. You may also be less inclined to try and subdue a suspect using non physical means.
That being said there are times when a suspect obviously is not going to go willingly, and an officer would prefer to arrest them with the least amount of force necessary and with the least chance for harm to himself and to the suspect.
I think the main point here is that the officer needs to really think and feel in his head that the taser is a deadly weapon. Electricity can be deadly, and this is a high voltage piece of equipment. Electricity doesn’t just flow from one prong to another as a poster above said. This tool causes a voltage to form across your entire body, every muscular neuron in your body will essentially fire when a strong enough potential difference is applied even superficially to your skin. That is where the immediate harm may be caused, since a small group of neurons controls the rhythmic beating of your heart.
wow so the phoenix pd go back in time as well or what?
“We went from 24 officer-related shootings in 2003 to 12 in 2002. But we didn’t stay there. In 2004″
Life’s real simple, dont be a jackazz and get the cops called on you, then you dont get zapped.
You are full of shit. I read the same report you apparently did.
167 cases of taser death. http://www.azcentral.com/specials/special43/articles/1224taserlist24-ON.html
You are totally twisting the facts.
Most of the deaths listed in the report say that is was because the subjects were on insane amounts of cocaine. Quit being sensational.
I’ve been tased 4 times and I’m still here.
Your paragraph quoting Dave Kelly: the years didn’t make any sense. I think you got them out of order – definitely distracts from the point you’re trying to make.
I fully agree with the point you have reiterated multiple times in the comments. Stop missing the point, people. It’s not about whether Tasers are better than guns. It’s about whether the company is out of line in intimidating scientific research and implying its products are completely safe – they are not.
From what you’ve laid out, it sounds like some of the company’s management are on the wrong side of the law, or dangerously close to it.
My problem is with Taser treating all their customers as criminals. You ever research buying one. When you buy a Taser cartridge for your weapon they register the serial number. When it’s fired, it shoots out hundreds of little papers with that number all over them so you can be tracked. I have a huge problem with that idea. Give me a real gun any day.
“safe” is a relative term. Tasers are weapons that are intended to keep the public safe. The alternatives to tasers are either guns, batons, or going hand-to-hand with a perp.
Cops aren’t trained to jump out of nowhere and stun anyone they choose. They’re dealing with serious scum on a daily basis, some of whom are out to kill.
Pepper spray, batons and fists are all potentially lethal too…
Chris, you’re line of logic is absolutely correct:
Chris
March 7th, 2007 at 12:35 pm
Let me make this simple, too:
In the cases where both the taser and the gun would work, it’s of course preferrable to use the taser.
But guns are not used that often, because cops know they probably kill. They’ll think twice.
If a cop thinks a taser is harmless, he will use it in much less threatening situations. You can find videos on youtube which show cops using the taser as a compliance tool in nonthreatening situations. And that is the problem. Tasers aren’t less than lethal, the correct term is “less lethal”
It’s very alarming if scientific research is suppressed.
You hear stories every other day of 67 year old GRANDMOTHERS being tasered, or withered old men being tasered by more than physically capable policeMEN. Disgusting.
What’s more disgusting is the recent report showing shootings taking place, at the hand of UNTRAINED police officers, due to the 90 day allowance given for being on the force, as long as future training takes place.
The POINT of this story, is the suing and deliberate attempt to strongarm SCIENCE in favor of PROFITS, and godd*mn I can’t stand people who can’t think outside of the box, and understand larger contexts. Jeez, authoritarian “do gooders,” huh?
The issue has already been hit on the head.
The fact that Taser is deemed a safe alternative gives the officers who deploy them no concerns about using them. The officers know if they have to utilize their firearm, they better DAMN well be able to justify their actions later on during the resulting investigation. How many times have you seen an officer pull his firearm and shoot someone in the leg because they are refusing to get on the ground ? A leg shot isn’t lethal either unless you whack an artery or major vein. . . .
The problem boils down to any Taser review that goes against the companies projected image is instantly a target for litigation. The dangerous game they’re playing here is the day the general consensus decides the devices aren’t as safe as previously claimed, Taser Inc is going
to find itself on the wrong end of a very, very large lawsuit that will likely destroy the company as we know it. Not to mention the lawsuits that will hit every law enforcement organization who ever used one. . . .
Bottom line is Tasers, like any other device / weapon at the officers disposal, should be used as a last resort. Ya I know there are folks out
there who probably need to be hit with these things ( most of my family is law enforcement ) but far too many folks who don’t usually end up getting zapped because of an impatient officer on the other end of the Taser.
Just my .02
i think we’re all agreed that it’s better to be tasered than shot at. it’s a good thing that cops have an option thats in between the billy club and the service firearm.
an issue that’s coming to light, however, is whether cops (and event private security guards) are beginning to use the taser *too* much. a simple browse through fark.com would show lots of anecdotal evidence of instances where a taser was used unnecessarily. the evidence is only anecdotal, but that may be because the company that makes the taser is very litigious and this may hamper any serious effort in collecting independent, statistical evidence.
Did you know that roughly 300 drown each year in their bathtubs? You didn’t did you?! It’s because the Man doesn’t want you to know, man!!!
Big trouble with little lazers – This time head mounted ones at
http://thymesonline.co.uk
You have to wonder, if they are so safe, why they block scientific research?
If I had a product which some people claimed was harmful, but I was sure was not, I’d want tons of scientific research to be done os that they could prove that my product was safe.
Thus, continuing the logical thread, they don’t want research done because it’s not as safe as they claim.
As for Mustafa “I’m Not Fighting You!” Tabatabainejad, check out my blog entry:
http://www.pdsys.org/blog/2006/11/17/UCPDUCLAPoliceTaserAGuyTheBlogWorldFreaksOut.aspx
What a dumbass.
Isn’t getting shot bad for the ticker also???? so is getting beat by a night stick but noone has a problem with that stuff or well robbers do i guess
As someone who has used pretty much all of the “Less than lethal” devices to include clubs, CN, CS, Pepper spray, saps (yes I am old) the old “hand to hand” methods, I can honestly say that the stun gun has been the most extremely effective and less damaging method I have found. If I didn’t have a taser, pepper spray (Which I Hate to use) or anything else, I might have already had to use deadly force. Is it perfect? NO..Is it better than a club? Of COURSE.. Lets use some common sense here..
First things first, police are trained to in every case attempt to use a pistol in a less lethal fashion – ie to disarm and disabled rather than decease. Now, it is difficult to argue that tasers dont have a use in law enforcement. They do reduce the number of officer and perpertrator deaths each year. The problem lies in the Taser Company’s inability to accept peer reviewed scientific research that does not conform to what they say are the risks of their weapon. Where is the future for research science if company’s can simply block out research that they don’t like? They should use this research to help improve the Taser, rather then act like the problem does not exist.
I have used the Taser, I am a Taser Instructor. I have been Tased a number of times. I like the flexability it gives me as an officer. I have been a Police Officer for 28 years. It is easier for me to Tase an IDIOT, than to beat him with a baton. The baton is more fun but I am older and the Taser makes more sence. Those who do not want the Taser in the world are not looking at the big picture. In that case they may need to be beaten with a baton.
I find it interesting that one common argument seems to go along the line of “tazers are used instead of deadly force via guns; only a fool would rather be shot than tazered” or something to that effect.
On the surface, it makes a kind of common, folksy sense. But, like most similar statements, the “common sense”comes from the conclusion, “which is better?”
The logical error is that the premise is true: that police employ a Tazer in situations where deadly force is the only or even likely option. I can think of few situations where this is likely, let alone the norm.
Tazers are close weapons; guns are not. You do not tazer a fleeing suspect; you shoot them. You do not tazer a suspect that is a short distance away and points a firearm at the officer; you shoot them.
You do not threaten a distant suspect with a tazer any more than you would with a baton; you draw a firearm and allow the suspect to decide his chances, which are poor; the officer has some distance and time to fire on his side; that’s why it’s effective at getting suspects to allow themselves to be arrested.
You do not pull your firearm when wrestling with a suspect; you protect the firearm and subdue the suspect with physical force.
We can dismiss the possibility that an officer might choose not to shoot in those situations where it may be appropriate; certainly if he chooses not to shoot for whatever reasons, it remains that the same factors of sufficient distance and time to fire make the tazer a poor substitute.
No, we employ tazers in situations where close contact with the suspect makes it’s use possible at all; it’s a substitute for physical force, restraint, batons, etc, not deadly force with firearms. Officers are trained to protect and holster firearms in such situtations, lest the suspect acquire control of the firearm employ it upon the officer or others.
The whole “would you rather be shot” premise is bogus. It’s not even appropriate in a “would you rather be pepper sprayed” premise; although it is true that pepper spray can be employed in place of a firearm; it is the true substitute to deadly force.
I can say from personal experience as a police officer that I have sustained 2 on the job injuries from fighting with violent suspects who were high on drugs where leathal force was not justified, and if I had have a taser at that time the injuries would not have happend. When we got tasers, they became a valuble tool for us so we did not have to go hands on as often and officer injuries dropped.
Five more deaths proximal to Tasers during the last week:
245. Muszack Nazaire, 24, Collier County, Florida
March 13, 2007
246. Randy Buckey, 42, Marion County, Ohio
March 15, 2007
247. Ryan Lee Meyers, 40, Middle River, Maryland
March 16, 2007
248. David Brown, 47, Park Forest, Illinois
March 17, 2007
249. Unknown, ??, West Covina, California
March 17, 2007
All of the alleged law enforcement officers who have opinioned-up in favor of “Taser’em early & often” seem to have forgotten the oath they took on “gun & badge day”; that is to serve and protect!
Justifying your own usages by claiming less officer injury or shorter confrontation events or even less overtime is not even close to what the actual end-results have become.
The mentally handicapped, the drug or alcohol intoxicated, the aggressive and the non-compliant, when not armed with a deadly weapon or a dangerous instrument, should not die in a physical altercation with police.
Justifying the use of your Taser on a vehicle operator whose only fault is the slow retrieval of the vehicle registration from the glove box is tantamount to a criminal act.
Police administrators who advance the usage in most if not all patrol level altercations to maximize arrest numbers per work-shift all the while reducing overtime costs due to reduced man-hours per arrest is malfeasance in the highest order.
Taser master instructors suggested in their teaching, that the Taser be deployed at the lower levels of the Use-of-force Continuum because it related to more cartridge sales for the company. This is proven fact, not an innuendo.
Taser’s were promoted for deployment with each and every officer with a department because it amounted to more sales of units per agency. Those who instructed that it should only be deployed where additional (backup) officers were in attendance were unceremoniously terminated and their credentials revoked. This is proven fact, not an innuendo.
At no time during training (sales promotional) of agency personal for certification, were they told to limit the number of times that a subject should be taser’ed. Only when the death toll started to mount, did a factory training bulletin go out addressing the faulting non-instruction.
Police Officers have been sold a false bill of goods by Taser. In the beginning, Taser promoted a $2,000,000 insurance rider that covered each department and its officers. Where is that policy today?
The comment of Mark Kroll is part of why the Taser Co. has lost so much respect. I am a professor of physics and electrical engineering and I have verified the study made by Mr. Ruggieri. Also, an esteemed professor at Duke University at the United States, and a close former student of my at a national laboratory has also confirmed Ruggieri’s testing and results. I looked up Mark Kroll and note that he is employed by Taser. Why did he not reveal that he has a large axe to grind? This company has lost so much respect and affection and we will never use these equipment here in this country.
If you act like a JACKASS, you get treated like a JACKASS. The point is simple. Stay out of trouble and you have nothing to worry about. As far as March 7th, 2007 at 11:50 pm. Law enforcement might use a tazer a little sooner than they should, maybe even more often than they should. But they are ending a bad situation before it gets really bad. I have been tazed 7 times and I am sill here. They can’t be that bad. Mustafa Tabatabainejad refused to follow the policy of the library, so he gets treated like a “JACKASS”. Some people will camplain no matter what. Tazers should not be used. When tazers are not used and criminals end up getting shot, then the complaints are made that police should have used tazers instead.
On March 6, 2007, an interesting poster paper titled “A safe Taser dose: Evaluation of Taser-related in-custody deaths, with implications for law enforcement policy and training” was presented at the annual meeting of the American Physical Society (APS) held in Denver, Colorado. It drew favorable attention from those attending. [The abstracts of papers presented at APS meetings are published in the Bulletin of the American Physical Society, a periodical which has long been published in paper form, but in 2007 began publishing exclusively on the Web. Here is the citation to the abstract of this paper, published on the Internet in BAPS:
To get an easy-to-read typeset version of the abstract, click on “Preview Abstract”. Contact info for the author can be obtained from the abstract.
I typed a URL in my previous message but I notice it didn’t appear in the message when it was posted. Others posting here have been able to post URLs, so I don’t understand why MY attempt to post a URL wasn’t successful.
But let’s see if I can circumvent the obstacle. Here is the portion of the URL that follows the initial “://”
meetings.aps.org/link/BAPS.2007.MAR.K1.29
The main point of the paper is that the data on these human deaths make it appear that a single 5-second Taser shock is MUCH less lethal than longer shocks. (The qualifier “make it appear” has to be inserted because, at present, comparable data for non-lethal Taser shock outcomes has not been assembled, so the total incidence information is missing that would make it possible to draw firm conclusions about the lethal nature of Taser shocks of different lengths.)
I appreciate the list of recent Taser-related in-custody deaths posted by Canadian. I have been unable to verify that anyone named Keith Kallstrom was shot with a Taser in Milan, MI. The other listings posted by Canadian seem to be legitimate, and I have a new one to add:
Eugene Donjuall Gilliam, 22, who died April 10, 2007, in Prattville, Alabama, about 7 hours after he was shot with a Taser by Prattville police.
The deaths continue!
Another Taser-related in-custody death:
Sergio Galvan, 35, died immediately after being taken into custody by police (in a domestic dusturbance case) in San Antonio, TX, March 23, 2007. News reports indicate he had received at least 3 Taser shocks.
I have known Keith Eugene Kallstrom for almost my whole life. He was murdered by the police, they know it too! A man should not be murdered for what he believe’s. He went to expose someone & died for it. They want you to believe that tasers don’t kill but they do, how can they sleep at night!
If “ronald” who posted on April 27th that he knew Keith Eugene Kallstrom almost his whole life will post additional information about where, when and how Kallstrom died, I will make a further attempt to verify this. If this did happen in Milan, Michigan, was it on January 17, 2007, as “Canadian” reported?
I have succeeded in verifying that Keith Eugene Kallstrom died in Milan, MI, on Wednesday, Jan. 17, 2007. [Thanks, "ronald"; you motivated me to try harder!] But I haven’t yet verified the circumstances of his death, or that a Taser was used on him.
His age at death in the notice I saw was given as 57, not 56. If you know his date of birth, “ronald”, would you please post it? Thanks again; hope to hear from you soon.
Marjorie
Marjorie,
Keith Eugene Kallstrom was my brother and tazers were used on him at least 7 or 8 times that we know of and he had been in the courtroom and had chest pains and the court was stopped for an EKG and also he was hospilized and tested and they all knew he had heart trouble clear to the judge and it was on his court records….also I have records of the tazers that were done to him in the Bay City Jail. His birthday is October 30, 1949 and he was found in his cell they say at 7:30 am but they don’t know exactly when he died. He was tazered so badly and beaten that his attorney Anthony Chambers tried to stop the court proceedings and yet they were not and he was taken back to Milan with a sentence to die. I hope you understand…there is an autopsy pending and they didn’t even notify the family that he was dead. What do you think about this and then they tried to keep the family from getting the body before they destroyed it with cremation or buriel. The 48 hour stall…even the Ochelak Funeral Home tried to cover this up and said they didn’t know there was family and it’s all a lie as they clear up the Warden and top dogs at Milan knew and a US Marshall helped me to get my brothers body home for a proper buriel on my mother’s 78 birthday he arrived back in Oklahoma. Tazers killed him but the people that did this really did….just like guns kill but someone has to pull the trigger and murder was on the agenda…my brother knew information that has been being covered up for the OKC bombing and this is why he is dead and they are still out there////caution while you proceed with this as this is a deadly game.
“Marjorie” Keith Kallstrom was born October 30,1949. It’s reported that he died from a mild heart attack, but a second autopsy was done due to the circumtances that take place during his trial. I believe he died becuase of him being tasered.
Thanks to those who provided a birth date for Keith Kallstrom. With that information, I may be able to get a copy of his autopsy report when it is released. Lynn, do you know which agency is doing the autopsy? Milan occupies two counties, and if you know which one did the autopsy, it would save me the cost and time of trying to find out which one I should be talking to. I am glad that your family was able to get Keith’s body back, but I think a mistake was made in not having a careful medical examination of it made before he was buried. (I have a very specific procedure in mind.) However, autopsy records are usually accurate with respect to the factual details, even when the cause of death decision hs political overtones. So the autopsy is an important record worth having.
His autopsy was performed at the facility that Milan uses and he was at the Oshelak Funeral Home which they denied they knew family was involved and they said that he had no marks on his body which wasn’t true and Keith’s body was detained at the morgue for days. We had a private autopsy in Oklahoma City which is pending results (they say) as he was flown down from Michagan with the US Marshall’s help and they also assisted me in getting Keith’s body here and enabled the family access to Keith without any help from Milan Federal Prison and the people there all the way up the Warden and the people (Melissa) who did all they could to prevent us from obtaining his body. Mrs. Oshelak who owned the funeral home was unbelieveably rude and uncooperative and her assistant told us there was nothing or anything on Keith’s body to be concerned about and then they made a huge mistake when they knew they were sposed to fly Keith’s body to Oklahoma City first and not to Tulsa. I can get you more detailed information about this but Keith’s body had marks all over it from head to toe and the laser marks were very apparent when he was brought here and that was alot of days after. His attorney was Mr. Chambers and he knows alot about the case and Keith’s “beatings and tazerings” and he said he would do all he can to help us with this. Apparently, the state of Michigan is needing some court ordered medical record release from next of kin and that’s why we don’t have the results of the private autopsy from OKC but this doesn’t make any sense to us as it’s been since January ‘07 and he passed according to them on 1/17/07. The autopsy up there said he died of a “mild heart attack” and that’s what the Sheriff said happened to him in a newspaper report. He was tazered and beaten and we have records of this. Something is amis here. They didn’t want us to have the body to get a second autopsy and that is very apparent. But we do and we are still waiting for the results. I’m just his sister, and his mother got her son’s body back in the state of OK (dead) on her 78th birthday and we are still waiting for justice and answers/ I appreciate all you can do for this family. Please let me know because we love Keith and he is in a better place and he deserves to know and so do we…whatever the answer is we are prepared to know….thank you for all of your assistance to us. What is the very specific procedure? According to this autopsy doctor, they have found the silver bullet but we all are holding our breath and it’s been a very long time to know what that is. Yours truly, Lynn
His autopsy was performed at the facility that Milan uses and he was at the Oshelak Funeral Home which they denied they knew family was involved and they said that he had no marks on his body which wasn’t true and Keith’s body was detained at the morgue for days. We had a private autopsy in Oklahoma City which is pending results (they say) as he was flown down from Michagan with the US Marshall’s help and they also assisted me in getting Keith’s body here and enabled the family access to Keith without any help from Milan Federal Prison and the people there all the way up the Warden and the people (Melissa) who did all they could to prevent us from obtaining his body. Mrs. Oshelak who owned the funeral home was unbelieveably rude and uncooperative and her assistant told us there was nothing or anything on Keith’s body to be concerned about and then they made a huge mistake when they knew they were sposed to fly Keith’s body to Oklahoma City first and not to Tulsa. I can get you more detailed information about this but Keith’s body had marks all over it from head to toe and the laser marks were very apparent when he was brought here and that was alot of days after. His attorney was Mr. Chambers and he knows alot about the case and Keith’s “beatings and tazerings” and he said he would do all he can to help us with this. Apparently, the state of Michigan is needing some court ordered medical record release from next of kin and that’s why we don’t have the results of the private autopsy from OKC but this doesn’t make any sense to us as it’s been since January ‘07 and he passed according to them on 1/17/07. The autopsy up there said he died of a “mild heart attack” and that’s what the Sheriff said happened to him in a newspaper report. He was tazered and beaten and we have records of this. Something is amis here. They didn’t want us to have the body to get a second autopsy and that is very apparent. But we do and we are still waiting for the results. I’m just his sister, and his mother got her son’s body back in the state of OK (dead) on her 78th birthday and we are still waiting for justice and answers/ I appreciate all you can do for this family. Please let me know because we love Keith and he is in a better place and he deserves to know and so do we…whatever the answer is we are prepared to know….thank you for all of your assistance to us. What is the very specific procedure? According to this autopsy doctor, they have found the silver bullet but we all are holding our breath and it’s been a very long time to know what that is. Bay City County Jail is where the tazers occurred repeatedly and we have the records of the incidents according to them. Keith was detained there longer than necessary for reasons that Gerald Ford died and US Marshalls were needed for that time and also that the Prosecutor got ill and that detained him longer and there were many occurances of tazers used on Keith and those are in our possession. There is a man named James Wickstrom and also Keith’s ex wife Kathy Kallstrom who we know were aware of this as Keith had gone up there to get Kathy back and he did end up in prison over this. They are down here…Kathy for sure, in Tulsa, OK now and that is also another issue. Yours truly, Lynn
Ignoring the debate on the merits of Tasers for a moment, there is a serious flaw in the argument.
Did Mark Kroll (Chief Technologist of St. Jude Medical Cardiac Rhythm Management) and apparently on the board of directors at Taser, seriously make this dismissive statement:
“He also apparently solved the energy problem by getting 704 watts out
of a TASER device powered by a 30 watt pack of 8 AA cells.”
If that is Mark’s considered opinion, he is clearly incompetent to speak on the issue.
It is TRIVIAL to get 704 watts out of a 30 watt pack of batteries. It doesn’t break the laws of conservation of energy. ‘Watts’ is a measure of POWER, not ENERGY. A chief technologist working for Taser should be competent enough to know the difference.
For example, you could charge a capacitor from the 30 watt pack of batteries for 12 seconds, then discharge the capacitor in half a second … that would give you an output of 720 watts. (Ignoring inefficiencies – I’m pointing out the lack of logic here, not designing a circuit for them)
I hope that this was only a momentarily lapse of competence on Taser’s behalf.
I hope.
(PS: This comment is anonymous because it doesn’t rely on my identity to give it value. Any competent engineer will confirm the details.)
I can find many things that I look for here! Thank you very much!
I’ve read alot of these comments. All the people make good arrguments right or wrong, on the the issue of gun or tazed. Ok I just got out of court for a long and irritating process. To make it straight and to the point. I walked out of a bar having only one drink. I see bouncers having complete control of someone who apparently was escorted out of the building.
I walked by them on my way to my truck. Suddenly a bottle is whipped passed my head. I turned around and a bouncer told me, “We have the situation under control.” I replied, ” Then why did I almost get hit with a bottle.” He said,” Sorry just leave and we’ll take care of it.”
Well next thing the bouncer and I were both grabbed by people who had not annouced themselfs to who they were. I got slammed from behind into a suv face first, they were grabbing my arms very forcefully. I wasn’t sure why, but I went into protect mode I guess you would call it. I did not know what was happening and did not know why. So I held my hands and arms to my side while i was being hollered at and being forcefully grabbed.
What happened next was rediculous! I got turned to my side and instantly tazered! I felt like I got shot at first, but as I felt burning and electrical currents flowing through my chest. I figured I just been tazered. I fell to the ground shaking, sreaming at the top of my lungs, and flopping like a fish out the water.
I looked up and seen someone yelling for me to lay on my stomach. I could barely make out the words and very rattled. Wires where hanging out of my chest, so i didn’t want to lay completely on my stomach. So I rolled to my side and got tazered again, as if the first time wasn’t bad enough. This time I was completely limp and to be real about the situation almost crapped myself and started losing consciousness.
Then I was being cuffed and arrested. Talk about a goodnight huh. Well I’m thinking I’m going to be let go and nope I was wrong. They brought me to jail and I had to get out of jail on bond for Five hundred dollars. Because they charged me with disorderly conduct and resisting arrest. Talk about BS.
So for the last six months I’ve been going to court and finnally I just had jury trial because there was no way I was pleading to being guilty. For first of all being victimised and then being charged as a criminal. Well PEOPLE I was found NOT GUILTY! No surprise to me, but I was nervous as hell because they tried to put me in jail for this and I got a business to run and a life to live. The state was tring his hardess to make out to be the worst person in the world and the cops to be the most innocent perfect people.
Now I’m in a pickle, what should I do? Just let this go? Forget it ever happened? Or go for a law suit? If I sue will I win? Is it worth it? And I don’t want this to happened to someone else, so maybe those cops will think twice before they harass another person.
If u want reply here or at sanders_toby2000@yahoo.com