The long-running Psystar dispute may be settling down as the controversial PC-maker runs out of steam, but don’t think that’s the end of… the Clone Wars. (sorry)
German PC company HyperMegaNet UG has started selling its own line of cloned Apples. But good heavens, you say, aren’t they scared of Apple? Won’t they see the smoking ruins of Psystar and fear the same fate may be in store for them? Ah yes, but you forget: they’re German.
I don’t mean that in the sense that they’re industrious and methodical, but simply that they’re part of the European Union, where it’s possible that the law permits this piratical behavior. They certainly seem to think so. From their FAQ page:
7. Is the PearC legal?
Yes. According to european laws Apples EULA is void.
Well, it doesn’t get any more clear than that! They don’t cite any laws or explain themselves any further, but if the Pirate Bay’s legal defenses are any indication, things may indeed be rather different there. And if that is the case, I’m pretty surprised no one figured it out yet. Are other EULAs void? Is it just the portion of the EULA that prevents users from installing on non-Apple hardware? No doubt we’ll find out soon once the legal gears start a-turnin’.
As for the computers themselves, they appear to be as plain and functional as you’d expect any OEM machine to be. They’re expandable of course, with room on the inside for whatever you like. The “Starter” setup sports the basic stuff: a solid budget CPU and GPU, one hard drive up to 750GB, a DVD writer and lots of ports. Starts at ~$650.
The “Advanced” has some serious CPUs, decent GPUs, a Blu-Ray writer (or two if you like), and a second hard drive on which to install a second OS for dual-boot. In this case you can choose between OS X, Vista HP and Ultimate, and XP Pro (which costs more than HP, hilariously). It runs for more than the Starter, though final price depends entirely on your configuration. AppleTell suggests getting one “will most likely result in an unstable computer, operating system, and user experience due to the lack of true compatibility,” but that sounds like FUD to me.
This is a relatively new development, so we can speculate all we want. Any experts in international law feel like taking a crack at it?
Update: Looks like others have had their way with this story as well. HyperMegaNet says that “In Germany, EULAs are only legally binding when they are agreed to before the purchase of the software program.” Not exactly a bulletproof defense.
Hypermeganet? Wasn’t that the name of Homer’s IT startup???
It was :) If humor were all it takes…
We’re not sure what, if anything, CompuGlobalHyperMegaNet does. But rather than compete with you, we’re prepared to just buy you out.
Buy emmm out boys!! *breaks stuff*
LOL. Lucky for them, Steve Jobs isn’t nearly as gangsta as Bill Gates.
If those guys share procedures on how to easily create these clones on the internet, once they reach latin america and other “lawless” regions, it’s game over for Apple’s witch hunt, and apple (Mac OSX) will go mainstream, which will probably be very bad news for Microsoft.
camouflaged pickups crossing the border at night, each with 500 kilos of clones – beige gold.
…And bad news for Apple
OS X Drives Apple Hardware sales, to make OS X work on other platforms would be to slow/stop hardware sales, thus the price of OS X must increase.
Software doesn’t have very high margins as it is, but eventually the companies will be dropping prices to try and get partners on board.
That combination means that Apple would surely lose lots of money, no?
Also, it being more mainstream will mean most likely, more viruses etc. and thus Doom! The Apocalypse, we shall be judged, 2012 etc.
I haven’t crunched the numbers recently, but as of ‘06, software accounted for roughly half of Apple’s profits. The other half was iPods and computer hardware. So, to continue to pretend that Apple’s primarily a hardware company is just silly.
Furthermore, you think that software isn’t high-margin? And you think that hardware is? Hmm. Sure, Apple’s margin on their hardware is better than the rest of the market (because they overcharge drastically), but there’s a lot more margin in software.
Hardware and software both require R&D. Hardware has the additional expense of manufacturing, which software does not have. Also, hardware is highly standardized, and a lot of manufacturers compete, which drives sale-prices down. Software is all proprietary and insulated from competition (open-source being the exception). There’s nothing to drive down prices, and each copy sold is pure profit (after you’ve recouped expenses).
I call BS. Show me the numbers where software accounts for half of Apple’s profits. So they made about 850 million in profit on software in the last quarter? Hell, I don’t even know that they sold that much software!
If Apple (computers) ever realize that they are a software company that packages computers with their OS THEN MS would have some problems. Until then… no change in status quo.
You assume that mac os is capable of handling hardware it was never tested against. I would bet it will fail like a dead bird once it goes mainstream
This is legal in Germany since you only see the EULA right AFTER you installed Mac OS X. The current law says that you must be able to see the EULA before you use/install a product, if OS X is installed and you only see the EULA after doing so it is void.
That’s what I got from different reports about ‘Hypermeganet’ in the last couple of weeks. Not sure if this is true, but that’s sort of the essence from different websites.
Devin I am sorry to say this but you are a moron… comparing this with thepiratebay.
Questionably legal activities sheltered by variations in local law?
Legal:
1: of or relating to law
2 a: deriving authority from or founded on law : de jure b: having a formal status derived from law often without a basis in actual fact : titular c: established by law ; especially : statutory
3: conforming to or permitted by law or established rules
http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/legal
There is nothing questionably. If (local) law states that EULAs are void if not agreed to before the purchase is made it’s legal. As simple as that.
It may be morally questionably (which it isn’t, at least in my opinion)
Thanks for explaining
Yup, sorry, Devin. But your “piratical behavior” comment is plain stupid.
There is nothing piratical to be seen here.
Man. This is an awesome article
I know!
In Germany EULAs aren’t binding because you cannot read them before you buy the product. Simple as that … even if we have to click on “I agree” before installing the software.
Apples EULA is void in Brazil too.
So if Apple just puts “By buying this product you agree to only use this on Apple licensed computers” on the leopard install CD box, this company would no longer be able to sell these clones?
The EULA is probably invalid in most jurisdictions but there are many other legal barriers involved in creating a clone. Particularly copyright and patents.
It’s not correct to group all of the EU into one bucket. Or to connect Pirate Bay in Sweden with activities in Germany which has a different legal system. There isn’t really an EU legal system as such. It isn’t like the US Federal system. Each country has its own legal framework it is just that the treaties of the EU have setup a process where the EU defines some basic legislation in some fields that individual countries must add into their legal system. Casses are judged by each countries courts according to that countries laws. It is as if the Federal Government told every State that it must have emissions laws and that they may only allow up to X amount of lead in emissions. The body of laws in each country is only slightly affected by this process. There is a European court to which you can appeal but it is similar to a constitutional appeal where you are saying that your country didn’t implement a just law that followed the EU directives.
It’s also very questionable if it is practical to run a business which could only sell its systems in countries where they had clarified the legal situation for that product’s patents and copyright. The liabilities would be too great. So lets hope that in the interests of competition that HyperMegaNet have thought some of that process through and aren’t just a pile of techies getting carried away.
A bit of further clarification (which may be superfluous, apologies if it is).
The EU requires members to include certain legislation into the member countries legal system. It doesn’t mandate the exact method/wording of the law, just the impact the law should have.
This sometimes leads to differences in implementation and legal definition in some areas.
I don’t think the comparison with the Pirate Bay case is necessarily spurious, there are differences in national legal systems which are being put forward as justification for certain actions/attempting to proscribe certain actions.
It’s not ‘piritical’… copyright isn’t even involved.
It *may* be a breach of the appropriate contract law, if such laws are poorly written.
TINLA.
For some of us macfans this is scary but at the same time, with Apple’s latest hardware releases that keep clawing back features such as firewire, fewer usb ports, poor screens etc, what will it cost to get a top end computer to ship with top end parts and considerations?
I don’t look forward to an OSX that gets passed around to all these cheap computers that look like bad drum sets but if they get out into the wild, they had better impact this lazy Apple Inc.
Sorry to chime in again but I wonder at the legality of Apple’s EULA in many countries. I hardly have hope that Apple can bind the world to their company desires.
Though a dyed in the wool macfan, this news is interesting and hopeful for the end user at least from my point of view: Apple demand far too much of their users assume too much. They are not law makers though they may wish they were. I’m not ready to buy into a philosophy of being in a big family where my computer, os, tv and everything knows about me as the consumer and my habits and tracks where I am. It will be nice to see Apple have to trim their fat on this issue.
“scary” or “hopeful”? make up your mind
So why buy Apple then? If you don’t like their rules, buy something else. It’s not like you don’t have a choice. You don’t have to play by their rules; and they certainly don’t have to play by yours.
The beauty (and downfall) of Apple is they have vertical control over their products and clones like this could turn their cash cow into a cheap commodity but also tarnish their image with shitty “macs”.
hang on…
“In Germany, EULAs are only legally binding when they are agreed to before the purchase of the software program.” Not exactly a bulletproof defense.
Since when has legally binding agreements NOT been bullet proof?
How does the EULA form the beginning and end of the argument?
Last I checked, Disney merchandise didn’t come with a EULA at all, but I’m pretty sure I couldn’t buy a truckload of Mickey Mouse stuffed animals and resell them as “Mickey The Big, Gay, Dog-Fucker Mouse”.
Whats the problem?
Who is going to be able to afford Mac Products when this depression really bights.
It would be a good move for Apple to let one clone company slip through the net or even better buy it out and fund it for cheaper variants to be released that are not as expensive, Apple are in for problems if they don’t lower prices in the future anyway.
I love how in Germany there are just no laws!
“I love how in Germany there are just no laws!” … what does THAT mean ??? Of course there are laws, their interpretation is just very specific, namely that you must be able to read the EULA before you buy the software. In Europe we also think it’s crazy that in the US you can just run out and buy a gun. You should travel a little before making such comments.
Germany’s probably most important news magzine, DER SPIEGEL, reported on that HyperMegaNet guys as well and it really seems to be the case that it’s not binding to present the EULA to the user after he or she bought the product.
But despite the whole legal concerns, are those computers really working like a regular iMac or Mac Pro? Or at least close to that. I’m missing some reviews about the system.
Okay, I got myself an answer: SevenMac (http://www.sevenmac.de/tv/screencasts/1081-sevenmac-testet-den-mac-clone-qpearcq-mit-video) says that it’s like an PC with Mac OS X – if you want to have kind of mac feeling at a low price, you can buy it, but leave it otherwise. But anyway the OS is running without problems.
i like this, kind of.
What if you want to use Mac OS on a quite powerful computer with 2 screens ? You are screwed. All you can do is buy a way overpriced Mac Pro, there is no other choice. So i would love to use Mac OS on regular PCs.
Or an iMac. Or a Mac Mini. Or a MacBook. Or a MacBook Pro. Or a MacBook Air.
Great example, you’re right — it’s unpossible to have a Mac setup with 2 monitors.
yeah…But what if i want to use my 2 24″ inchers ? Macbook and Macbook Pro/Air only have one DVI Out…you could use some kind of Matrox Dual Link DVI Crap but thats emulating one big screen and you have the dock in the center splitted on both screen and stuff like that. Not desirable.
iMac has a DVI OUT yes, still i cant use my 2 existing screens and its only DualCore.
Mac Mini = only dual core and only one DVI Out..
So ? Theres only the Mac Pro like i said before.
So, during the iPhone craze, I was faced with the same problem.
At first, I thought a MacPro was overpriced, and thought of building a hackintosh, etc.
However, if you price out the parts that go into a base-level MacPro (not including any memory upgrades), you’ll find it’s *cheaper* than the same box from Dell. (The Xeons and Intel motherboard account for a significant amount of the price.)
Having done this comparison, I realized that I should just buy a MacPro, because I get my money’s worth, plus the assurance that it’s a genuine Apple part. (For me, any downtime costs a lot of money, so I don’t want to screw around with alternatives. Your mileage may vary…)
Thank god I live in EU.
Let the competition decide, right? As an apple user since 1992 I can still honestly say that apple HW is usually overpriced, so competition in this case is more than good. So, let the market decide since it seems that EU has some pretty cool laws after all.
http://twitter.com/Werner/status/855389903
Strange how people who fanatically promote openness are lined up outside a shop that delivers some of this era’s most closed/lockedin tools
by Werner Vogels
C’mon guys…
Apple should just give the software away for free right?
Just like like warner, sony/BMG, and other labels. Right?
There’s no such thing as pirating movies or songs, so it’s the same with apple’s OS. Heck, it started as FreeBSD so OSX is a just remix of free code.
Give it away
Give it away
Give it away, now!
Yeah, what Luca F / Warner Vogels said.
Just give the remixed software away
Right. And in addition we still have currency which deserves this name through which we’ll be able to buy it….if we wanted to
Actually APPLE’s position is illegal in Europe. In Europe forced sale is illegal. It would be like if you go to the suppermarket and you are only allowed to buy oranges if you buy apples. This is illegal here. The OS and the HW are considered two distinct components here. Apple cannot force consumers to buy their HW in order to use their SW. It’s quite easy to understand from a consumer’s protection point of view. This is ONE reason why APPLE’s EULA is partially void here.
To clear this up a bit more:
A few years ago Microsoft tried to enforce their OEM clause because dealers started selling cheap OEM versions of Windows without a PC and that’s illegal according to the EULA.
Microsoft lost that case. Since that time you can get Windows for around 70Euro here because all dealers nowadays only sell the OEM version.
So the message is – don’t sell in Europe.
Don’t sell hardware, software or music or semiconductors, etc because they basically don’t respect any kind of intellectual property.
We should encrypt evertyhing we sell to them so tit can’t be reversed engineered.
We should take their SAP software and pirate it on the net too. Teach those Germans a lesson.
you can encrypt something but only to a point. someone smarter than you will eventually break your encryption.
i think the point that you are forced to have two products in one is valid. while i can make no intriguing addition to any argument: the state of germany’s legal system if i understand it support the rights of the individual and the state of the american legal system is to support the corporation.
eventually, you americans too will probably want to have your legal system looking out for your rights rather than the rights of a company or companies that just want your money.
Well done – you get the prize for the dumbest comment on the article.
The debate is NOT am i allowed to pirate or steal any IP, but whether i am forced to only put apple software on apple hardware – and due to a reported implementation of user agreements law in Germany, apple can’t force you to agree to that like they can in the US.
Did you read it?
I wouldn’t want to buy one of those German fake Macs unless I thought that Apple was going to support their OS on that hardware. Short of that, and the poor user is on his/her own. I doubt that the Germans can force Apple to support non-Apple endorsed hardware.
First software, now hardware!
I guess they aren’t the world’s top exporters for nothing.
It is in Apple’s best interest to not let these guys or anyone else sell clones of Macs. It will only highlight the issues with their operating system.
It is easy to develop an OS that works almost flawlessly when the hardware is set and you don’t have to worry about all the other combinations that could occur when the OS runs on any PC.
The clones will only highlight issues with the OS and invite the same people who decided to attack Microsoft OSs and expose issues with those OSs to do the same with OS/X.
I, for one, don’t really like the business practices of Apple but I have to admit that my MacBook works amazingly well when compared to my various Dell Laptops with the various flavors of Windows and Linux.
@dont sell in europe. It’s bullshit to say we don’t respect intellectual property. Software is protected in Europe from the moment it is written by authors rights, the same as music, a book or a painting. Not even need to patent it like in USA. Hardware can be patented and it is respected. Actually France is the country in the world where music authors are given the most money per capita in Author rights. Even bars have to pay an important tax that goes to authors if they want to put music from the radio. However we respect free market and don’t accept monopolies of any kind which is why we protect consumers. For example, if you get a mortgage in US, you are often “forced” to get a life insurance from the same bank to cover the mortgage. Here the bank can ask you for an insurance, but you are free to get the cheapest insurance that covers the mortgage. NOT IN THE US. The same for travel insurances tied to flights, etc. The same for music, why if I buy a piece of music would I only be allowed to play it on a proprietary device like the IPod. This would give IPods a monopoly. I am sure you understand that monopolies are not good for society, and this is why we have these laws. To protect the rights of consumers and avoid monopilies.
@dont sell in europe. It’s bul*****t to say we don’t respect intellectual property. Software is protected in Europe from the moment it is written by authors rights, the same as music, a book or a painting. Not even need to patent it like in USA. Hardware can be patented and it is respected. Actually France is the country in the world where music authors are given the most money per capita in Author rights. Even bars have to pay an important tax that goes to authors if they want to put music from the radio. However we respect free market and don’t accept monopolies of any kind which is why we protect consumers. For example, if you get a mortgage in US, you are often “forced” to get a life insurance from the same bank to cover the mortgage. Here the bank can ask you for an insurance, but you are free to get the cheapest insurance that covers the mortgage. NOT IN THE US. The same for travel insurances tied to flights, etc. The same for music, why if I buy a piece of music would I only be allowed to play it on a proprietary device like the IPod. This would give IPods a monopoly. I am sure you understand that monopolies are not good for society, and this is why we have these laws. To protect the rights of consumers and avoid monopilies.
nice. you gotta love the germans!
good to see some people havent changed. But yes, they could :). And they still can. Yes, they can.
legal or not- i wonder about the performance and stability of these systems. anyone tested one the german mac clones?
I’d be concerned:
Two days ago I wrote a post about ‘Blood Diamond’ minerals being used in products like the iPhone.
The next day my iPhone stopped working.
Coincidence?
http://www.firstcollegenowwhat.com/2009/02/slaves-built-my-iphone/
@ Devin
This article smacks of sensationalist journalism. I still don’t know what you’ve tried to achieve by writing the article in the way that you have.
I think the EU has been fantastic in curbing the enthusiasm of many cowboy companies & I’m not even European.
“where it’s possible that the law permits this piratical behavior”
If your intention is to educate us with breaking news, then do that. If I wanted to read propagandist theories I would have subscribed to the Wall Street Journal.
well come on now theay are german and lets be honest German company’s just dont seem to get computers and teh intertubes at a profesional level, hobby programmers and very good grey area hackers yes
And german consumer laws can get very strange no BOGOF deals
theres also the knee jerk anti americanisiam in some euopean contries to contend with.
Heh, I’d like to see these clones users bring their busted box into an Apple store.
“Well, it’s running your OS, so it should be covered, right?? Nvm, that it doesn’t look all appl-ish”